[分享]冰岛变成坏分子

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Jun
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[分享]冰岛变成坏分子

Post by Jun » 2008-11-11 20:23

英国政府把冰岛定性为恐怖分子,强制冻结本国人民在冰岛银行的储蓄。

http://ftalphaville.ft.com/blog/2008/10 ... -deposits/

[quote]UK terror law used for Iceland deposits

The UK signalled Wednesday it would use anti-terrorism powers to recoup money owed to UK depositors in a failed Icelandic bank in a move that risked sending Britain’s relations with Reykjavik to their lowest since the 1970s “cod wars”.

UK taxpayers are likely to pay out at least £2.4bn as part of a £4.6bn scheme to compensate hundreds of thousands of account holders at Landsbanki, the Icelandic lender, according to Whitehall sources. Alistair Darling, chancellor, offered a blanket guarantee to UK retail depositors with money placed in Icesave, a failed internet bank owned by Landsbanki, which was seized by Iceland on Tuesday and declared insolvent. Icesave has about 300,000 UK customers, nearly equivalent to Iceland’s entire population. But wholesale depositors in failed Icelandic banks
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Knowing
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Post by Knowing » 2008-11-11 22:48

英国早就这样威胁冰岛了呀。
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豪情
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Post by 豪情 » 2008-11-11 23:33

强制冻结本国人民在冰岛银行的储蓄。
谁的被冻结啊?
外国银行在美国的支行一般都有FDIC吧. 难道英国不是这样?

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Post by CAVA » 2008-11-12 2:27

我原先还不相信有那么多人会把钱存到冰岛去,那天跟一印裔出租司机聊天,他说一个朋友贪其高利息,把全部家当都存到该网上银行,想一年后赚一笔再转移。结果老本也赔进去了,如今只好等国家发还一部分,具体多少还不最清楚。

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Post by Jun » 2008-11-12 11:39

英国政府跑去冻结冰岛的银行。据我的理解。
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Knowing
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Post by Knowing » 2008-11-12 11:47

Yes, because those iceland banks were offering high interest rate, people all over Europe put money in those banks. And lots of the account are not individuals but retirement fund of police department in UK small town, etc.

外国银行在美国的支行一般都有FDIC吧. 难道英国不是这样?
No, UK didn't have FDIC equivalence.
Yes, UK government had to offer sth similar very recently after Northern Rock.

And Iceland government refused to garantee those deposit, which pissed UK government off. But truth is Iceland government did not have to money. So they had been fighting since begining of Oct.

My understanding is UK government is freezing iceland bank's assets in UK. Because London is pretty much the financial center of Europe, UK government has some leverage.
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豪情
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Post by 豪情 » 2008-11-12 11:53

他们没FDIC所以也没权力直接接管冰岛银行是吧. 所以要用反恐怖法案. 如果在美国, 外国银行都是在美国注册子公司, 交FDIC保险, 受FDIC监管.
那这事也不能怪冰岛政府吧, 人家从来没有给私营银行提供过保证. 当然这种时候就比那个国家拳头硬了.
冰岛向中国借钱呢. 中国真聪明, 一个扩大内需就经济, 赶快把钱花掉, 把什么都推掉了. :mrgreen:

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Post by 豪情 » 2008-11-12 12:04

说到高利息, 香港好多名人买了LEHMAN的10%利率的债卷呢. 还上街游行. 美国有家BROKERAGE向退休人士推荐这个债卷, 现在在打官司.

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Post by Knowing » 2008-11-12 12:26

Yeah, I feel so bad for them. Those retirees are easy target, and Lehman sounded perfectly safe back then.
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Post by nanping » 2008-11-12 13:20

豪情 wrote:LEHMAN的10%利率的债卷
Yeah, that's just too good to be true, at least for AA+ bonds.

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Post by 豪情 » 2008-11-12 16:41

所以现在不是有人建议大家别投资了, 交给政府管.

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Post by DeBeers » 2008-11-12 20:36

对,政府再去买银行的股票,给保险公司钱让他们花天酒地。有谁懂得的给解释一下,这个财政部长咋回事,打着买啥啥的旗号从国会要来钱然后一摸脸就变卦改买别的了,跟挂羊头卖狗肉似的 :worthy:
钻石恒久远

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Post by nanping » 2008-11-12 21:39

据我这个外行人的半吊子理解,宝森原来是说要用大伙儿纳税人的钱,去买银行手里那些没人要的大幅贬值了的次贷资产,好让银行甩掉坏账包袱正常运作;他老人家如今的新主意是直接花钱买这些银行的股票,或者直接贷款给银行。

一般经济学家更喜欢后面这个新主意,因为可操作性强,见效快。但是股票市场认为宝森朝令夕改,不确定性太强,往少里说也是个全局观太差,能力不足,不信任他能够带领经济走出衰退,所以今天股价大跌。

唉,帅哥快指个新人选吧。

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Post by Knowing » 2008-11-12 22:43

买坏次贷债卷的问题是不好定价。定贵了,政府吃亏。定便宜了,银行还是要破产。
现在金融机构之间的credit 危机比通过TARP的时候稍微好点,但是整个危机已经向retail 扩散,最近一周尽是零售商的悲惨消息,汽车业,电子产品,咖啡,macy's. 今天市后intel 紧急暂停交易,发布很差的业绩报告,说明已经扩散到pc 市场。所以包森说要用剩下的一半来救零售商。
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豪情
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Post by 豪情 » 2008-11-13 2:11

PAULSON是不是反正要下台了, 撕破脸给关系户捞一把为自己下台后铺路?

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Post by Knowing » 2008-11-13 7:34

不是吧。不救他们不行啊。GM 都快要申请破产保护了。汽车业裁员数量大影响广,很可怕的。
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Post by 火星狗 » 2008-11-13 7:42

今天的保森不知道会不会是明天的帅哥,嗯
如果是爱,就怎么也不可怕。
只是梦境而已。

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Post by Jun » 2008-11-13 7:54

GM 本来就有很大的贷款部门,这回亏惨了。
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Knowing
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Post by Knowing » 2008-11-13 9:39

GM is already in huge debt. Because of the credit crunch, they can't borrow any money from anyone any more. And because of the credit crunch, consumers don't want to buy cars. So they are so screwed.
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Post by sing » 2008-11-13 11:05

Knowing wrote:GM is already in huge debt. Because of the credit crunch, they can't borrow any money from anyone any more. And because of the credit crunch, consumers don't want to buy cars. So they are so screwed.
But I have no sympath toward GM. Two points I read about them:
1) GM is the 2nd largest private health provider in US. So they are more like a HMO, happen to also produce cars.
2) GM wage is ridiculous, they pay 70+/hour for assembly line work (I guess that's counting all the health care/retiree cost etc).

But still, if they don't change these fundamental things, giving them 20-30 billions doesn't make a big difference. It just buys a little time.

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Post by Knowing » 2008-11-13 11:20

I am not sure about the first one. I think they are "private health care provider" in terms they run their own pool for employees, not anyone else on the market. So they are not HMO. And I heard they just stopped providing healthcare benefit to their retirees because they are so short on money.
Second one, yeah, but so is Ford. The wage is high because of the union. They did not want to. They can't even layoff workers because even after laying them off they will have to pay 90% of the wage.
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Post by Jun » 2008-11-13 11:23

Uh ... actually GM and Ford have already moved most of their manufacturing to Mexico. I don't think unionized workers are the root of the problem.
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Knowing
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Post by Knowing » 2008-11-13 11:33

I don't know the details. My understanding is they still have quite a lot of manufacturing done in US, maybe not as much as used to.
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Post by 豪情 » 2008-11-13 11:56

PAULSON就这么撒手不管了么?

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Post by 笑嘻嘻 » 2008-11-13 12:16

I think outsourcing is mainly about making a job done with lower cost. So unionized workers is one of the major causes of the problem.
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Post by camellia » 2008-11-13 12:23

Union and management with no vision are the major issues for US auto maker. One of my friend is a designer for GM, he told me the management changed so frequently during the design of one car. The car came out really ugly since every manager put a piece his mind into it.

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Post by Jun » 2008-11-13 12:28

GM 一倒,NBC 也倒了,老默赶快准备好钱吧,Keith Oberman, Rachel Maddow 这些人都别想混下去了。
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Post by Knowing » 2008-11-13 12:31

? GE owns NBC, GM doesn't.
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Post by Jun » 2008-11-13 12:32

Oh sorry. My mistake. LOL. :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
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Post by 笑嘻嘻 » 2008-11-13 12:37

You have dreamed of "这些人都别想混下去了", haven't you? :mrgreen:
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Post by Jun » 2008-11-13 12:41

我的梦想是不会实现的,除非 NewsCorp 倒掉了。 :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
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